Chervonopisky Sergey Vasilievich. Sergei Chervonopisky: “It’s time to build, not destroy

23.09.2010

CHERVONOPISKY Sergey Vasilievich

In December 1979, as part of the 350th Guards Parachute Regiment of the 103rd Guards airborne division took part in hostilities, commanded a platoon, a reconnaissance company, and was the first commandant of Kabul airport. On November 11, 1981, he was blown up by an anti-tank mine, lost both legs, but thanks to strong spirit and continued his active life.
He worked as first secretary in the Cherkassy district committee of the Komsomol, was a people's deputy of the Verkhovna Rada of the USSR of the last convocation, ran for deputy of the second convocation of the Verkhovna Rada of Ukraine, won, but the elections were declared invalid due to low voter turnout.
Since 1990, Sergei Chervonopissky has been the chairman of the Ukrainian Union of Afghanistan Veterans, co-chairman of the All-Ukrainian Association "Social Justice", from 1992 to 2005 - head of the State Committee for Veterans Affairs. He is co-chairman of the international association “Combat Brotherhood - Without Borders”, deputy chairman of the Coordination Council of the Committee on the Affairs of Internationalist Soldiers under the Council of Governments of the CIS Member States.
Major General, awarded the Order of Bohdan Khmelnitsky, III degree, the Order of Daniil Galitsky, two Orders of the Red Star, four orders of foreign countries.

In those December days of 1979, we were at the training center of the 103rd Airborne Division Losvido (near Vitebsk, in Belarus). Anxious feelings appeared when the young soldiers (who had not even passed the necessary standards yet) were ordered to urgently take the oath... As luck would have it, on the evening of December 10, I (at that time a lieutenant, commander of a paratrooper platoon) did my laundry. Just went to bed, an hour later - combat alert! At first we took it lightly, like, what an alarm, and even a combat one, maybe in a training center, fuck you all... But the commanders quickly convinced us that everything was very serious! I’m in a slight panic: what should I do, because wet laundry is drying on the radiator in the barracks. How to put it on when the frost is 10 degrees! Then, however, I breathed a sigh of relief when I learned that we were still staying in place - the 317th regiment (Vitebsk) had already left, and the 350th (ours, Baravukhinsky) was still waiting for instructions. There was an opportunity to calmly prepare and dry off.

Soon we moved to Train Station. At the station I managed to write to my relatives, they say, I’m leaving for training, there’s no way to call, read the newspapers... We loaded up. The platoon was assigned a reserved seat car, and it was unheated. Even in the “winter landing gear” (special insulated uniform - author) it was terribly cold. We warmed ourselves up, running back and forth in the carriage... We thought it would become easier, warmer, when we arrived at the naval aviation base airfield in Bykhov. But there was also an unheated barracks waiting for us. They ran again... However, they soon found out that the neighboring building, where the military builders were located, was heated. Why are we worse? And heavily armed paratroopers break into the workers’ homes at night with shovels and concrete mixers... Nothing, they made peace. I settled down in Lenin’s room, put my backpack under my head and fell asleep sweetly - finally warm. In the morning, when I woke up, I found the entire battalion headquarters nearby - they were lying on the floor sloping...

There was also my ward, a young fighter nicknamed Gyulchetai (with his blush he resembled the young heroine from the cult film “White Sun of the Desert”). The boy was absent-minded and always late for formations. The sergeants decided to educate him. They formed a platoon and read out the order: “According to the laws of war, Private N is to be executed for chronic lateness in formation!” Cut off his head! And a sergeant was standing next to him with an ax... The fighter was seriously scared, but I seemed to calm him down and took him under my wing. So he then ran after me like a dog and didn’t lag behind...

Soon our battalion was determined to be landing by parachute; we had to repack the parachutes: at night, at minus 10, in the light of the Ural headlights and hurricane winds. As someone who knew the technology well, I was assigned to be a group leader in the An-22 Antey. It’s curious that I, a lieutenant, had an entire lieutenant colonel subordinate to me! According to the charter, all support troops are subordinate to the landing force. And the ship's commander, lieutenant colonel, too. So he reported to me: “Comrade Lieutenant, the plane is ready to take off.” The board was loaded beyond all standards: seven airborne combat vehicles of various modifications. Boxes with ammunition and dry rations are moored between them. A significant part of it was “torn apart” along the way (minced sausage, for example), because we were hungry and they took away the most delicious things.

They soon realized that the landing was not by parachute. First we flew to Tashkent, then to Engels. I confess that I was then involved in one unseemly matter. In Tashkent, when the Antey was being refueled, the fuel was not topped up. We sold two tons, took five bottles of vodka and a snack. We drank all the vodka while flying to Engels. The consequences of that situation were severe, in terms of a hangover... We waited there for a week, twice we were picked up “idle”. And on the third we went straight to Kabul. However, we later found out where (commanders from the battalion and above knew, but they didn’t tell us, it was a strict secret). By the way, I only recently learned that some commanders (up to the battalion commander) allegedly visited the Afghan capital on reconnaissance in the summer. Although this is not a fact, maybe just rumors...

It all started with a tragedy. When landing in Kabul, the Il-76 flying in front of us hit the top of a mountain with its belly and crashed. I was in the cockpit of the Antaeus, I saw all this glow. A service platoon of our second battalion and an airborne support company, a tanker with 93 gasoline, and two vehicles with ammunition were killed. There was something to explode! Mishka Golubev died there, my friend...

Finally we sat down. They gave us 8 minutes to unload; the plane's engines did not turn off. After all, in 10 minutes the next board will arrive. To be honest, we had great difficulty getting our equipment started because of the extreme cold, but we managed to move out to our battalion. Soon I was appointed commandant of the airport. And the service began...

The current head of the Ukrainian Union of Afghanistan Veterans, who aroused the distrust of his comrades, led to a split in the organization. “There is no other way out. Sergei Vasilyevich forced the Afghans to create their own union, in which there will be no place for lawlessness and stupidity,” Major General Alexander Volkov said today at a meeting of the USVA board.

The meeting of the USVA board, which took place in Kyiv on December 24, 2013, became a landmark for the members of the organization in the entire history of its existence. Once again, through blatant and blatant violation of the USVA charter, the principles of fair election, people who in Afghan society are associated with the leadership of the veteran movement of Ukraine were removed from the board of directors, namely, the leader of the Odessa Afghans Afanasy Radukan, the chairman of the USVA KRO Sergei Kunitsyn, the head Chernivtsi Union Stanislav Kozak and first deputy chairman of the USVA Yuriy Zubko. It is also noteworthy that at the time of voting for the exclusion of Sergei Kunitsyn from the board, 14 heads of regional unions were against it and only 9 voted in favor. However, despite the protest from representatives of the Crimean and Sevastopol veterans’ unions, Sergei Chervonopisky counted the exception, adding to those who were “for” the votes of his deputies. Such a staging caused deep public outrage in the Afghan community. “Odessa Afghans openly and officially expressed no confidence in the head of the USVA Sergei Chervonopisky. We collected 42 statements from the leaders of local unions in our region and insist that Chervonopisky acts in the interests of a split in the Ukrainian Union of Afghan Veterans,” Afanasy Radukan commented on the situation. In turn, a number of other regions of the country, including Crimea, Poltava, Chernivtsi, and Sevastopol, expressed distrust in the current chairman of the USVA Sergei Chervonopisky. It is in these areas thatunprecedented xand unlawful actions with the intervention of local authorities, attempts were made to change the leaders of veterans' unions. “Today we see how our organization is actively being destroyed and causing discord between members. At the head of this lawlessness is Mr. Chervonopisky, who, with the patronage of the authorities, is trying to do everything to ensure that the Afghans cease to represent a monolithic social movement. The dirtiest methods are chosen for this and vile. Many, including me, were struck by the removal from the post of first deputy chairman Yuri Zubko, who did not support the performance started by Sergei Vasilyevich," said Alexander Volkov, a participant in the USVA board meeting, first deputy chairman of the USVA KRO.
People's Deputy delegated by the Afghan public to the Ukrainian Parliament, Sergei Kunitsyn, believes that the point of tension has been reached and the patience of the veterans has run out. "We cannot sit and watch as they try to artificially destroy our military brotherhood. We cannot put up with the fact that many Afghans now do not want to have anything to do with the USVA, because there is great antipathy towards the current head. We openly declare the creation of our own Ukrainian Union of Afghanistan Veterans, as well as local wars. Let this split in the organization be on the conscience of Sergei Vasilievich, who, by his behavior, forced people to leave the USVA and become disillusioned with the honesty and justice of its leadership. Today's board meeting destroyed the last bridge, the last drop of common sense was lost. Let the public and time give an assessment of these actions on the part of Chervonopisky." Sergei Kunitsyn also added that the creation of a new Ukrainian Union of Afghanistan Veterans was a collegial decision made with the support of most regions of the country. Ukrainian Afghans are ready for this step and will support a new organization that will unite Afghan veterans, as well as local workers, into a single whole.

The fate of Sergei Vasilievich Chervonopisky has parallels with the hero of “The Tale of a Real Man” Alexei Meresyev - amputation of both legs after a serious injury, doctors’ doubts about the possibility of not only leading a full active life, but even moving independently, and another victory - over themselves and pessimists .
A graduate of the Ryazan Airborne School, 22-year-old senior lieutenant Chervonopisky went to Afghanistan from the first day of the entry of Soviet troops there, was the first commandant of the Kabul airport, and commander of a parachute company.

Today, Major General Chervonopisky is a personality known not only in Ukraine, but also abroad due to his active life position. He devoted almost his entire life to the fight for the social rights of “Afghans” and people with special needs.

From the socio-political and government experience of Sergei Vasilyevich - deputy in the Supreme Soviet of the USSR, where in 1989 he was a self-nominated candidate, which was rare even for those times of perestroika. Since 1991, he has been the head of the Ukrainian Union of Afghanistan Veterans and headed the State Committee of Ukraine for Veterans Affairs. He is the guest of the next press conference at the Journalists Foundation of Ukraine:

— Sergey Vasilyevich, let’s talk a little about you. Now you have returned from the war...

- They brought me... on a stretcher. I miraculously survived when our fighting machine landing party was blown up by a mine. Only my legs “chickened”. Since then I have celebrated two birthdays... Many did not believe that I would get up at all - a very high amputation. They predicted that I would be asking for beer at the market. In practice, there are very few people who walk with such an amputation... And I, you see, with one stick.

— What feelings did you experience then, at the age of 24, being left without both legs? Were there despair or depression?

- You know, no. Of course, the support of my relatives helped; my future wife came from Cherkassy every weekend. I was confident. Then I told my mother: Mom, don’t worry, you will still be proud of me.

— Then you got married, you had two children: a son and a daughter. How is your relationship with children?

- Okay, friendly. My son graduated from the Academy of the Ministry of Internal Affairs this year. We recently mastered scuba gear together and went underwater together. At the age of 10, Vadim was the champion of the Cherkasy region in swimming in his age category. Hunting and fishing together. I can’t imagine life without this and I taught it to my children. Daughter, Darina, is still studying at the university.

— You became the founder of the “Afghan” movement in Ukraine. How did the idea of ​​creating an All-Ukrainian Veterans Organization come about?

“Honestly, the first time such a thought came to me was when at the prosthetic factory the elevator operator demanded that my mother get a C grade in order to lift me on a stretcher... I decided for myself then: we must stick together, otherwise we will perish.”

In 1989 we created the Union of Soldiers-Internationalists of Ukraine. By the way, this was the first Ukrainian public organization, created and registered without the knowledge of Moscow. Its main goal was the social protection of former Afghan soldiers, veterans of other wars, perpetuating the memory of the dead and the patriotic education of youth. The Union really helps disabled war veterans and the families of those killed. We pay for operations, teach orphans at universities. We earn money for this ourselves. We organized prosthetic workshops that use Hi-tech and equipment. A rehabilitation center successfully operates in Odessa, where about 400 veterans and members of their families recover their health annually.

— It’s no secret that the attitude of the masses towards the participation of Soviet troops in the war in Afghanistan has never been unambiguous. Are “Afghans” now receiving an understanding of their problems from the state?

— People’s attitudes towards the Afghan war and its participants have changed several times in our country. At first - in the late 70s - everything was secret, and even on graves it was forbidden to write that he died in Afghanistan. Then, in the early 80s, they suddenly decided to glorify us. Unfortunately, during the development of democracy, at first there was some kind of spitting on the “Afghans”; they tried to make us murderers, as if we ourselves went there of our own free will... We had to fight for our soldier’s honor. And now in Ukraine “Afghans” are assessed as soldiers who honestly fulfilled their duty. This is evidenced by the following fact: neither in Russia nor in Belarus there are as many monuments to the fallen “Afghans” as in Ukraine.

At the same time, today attempts to forget Afghanistan at the state level, unfortunately, continue. Sometimes you hear the old phrase new way: “Ukraine did not fight in Afghanistan,” followed by ignoring the fate of the guys who, through no will or fault, lost their health in that war. More than 30 thousand of them still do not have their own housing. The law regarding the employment of “Afghans” is also not being followed. We are not subject to the law on special merits, and our military orders are proposed to be considered peacetime awards!

Previously, our needs were at least a little listened to, because there was a State Committee for Veterans Affairs. Now it has been liquidated.

Well, isn’t it a shame that the mothers of those killed in Afghanistan receive additional payments of 29 hryvnia per month? Isn’t it a shame - 180 hryvnia pension for a disabled war veteran of the first group, who has neither experience nor length of service (and where will they come from if they were drafted into the army at the age of 18)? Let me remind you that more than 160 thousand children from Ukraine went through the Afghan war. Every sixth living Afghan has a disability.

“Afghan” veterans are still quite young people aged 35-50 years old who are fighting for social relevance and who can give many a head start in their ability to “hang on” to life.

Our union has strategically identified the Socialist Party as its political partner and, together with the socialists, intends to seriously fight for the opportunity to solve the problems of its fellows.

— Since you touched on the party topic, what dictated your decision to join the Socialist Party and the corresponding recommendation to everyone? former members party "SVICH"?

— The SWITCH party has always declared its center-left orientation. That is, socialists are ideologically close to us. Therefore, 42 thousand members of the Ukrainian justice party “SWITCH” have already joined the Socialist Party.

In addition, what attracts us to the SPU is a real unifying, so to speak, idea. I believe that this is exactly the party that is capable of “stitching” the country together. This is close to us, because among the “Afghans” there is no so-called regional confrontation, no matter where they live - in Lvov or Sevastopol. We understand: the time is to build, not to destroy.

And, of course, we will do everything to make any wars impossible in the future. By the way, from the very beginning we opposed the introduction of our troops into Iraq. Those who have looked into the eyes of death and seen the death of friends especially value human life.

— What do former “Afghans” who returned from the war remember when they get together many years later?

- When we get together, it’s not customary to talk about the war out loud - it’s sort of bad manners. But it was there that many guys learned the true friendship, brotherhood, and support that existed between us. And that’s why “Afghan” songs touch everyone’s soul, and we all dream about this war at night. And I dream about her, and in these dreams I am not on prosthetics, but on my own legs.

— You have been awarded many high titles, awards, orders and medals. What reward do you consider most valuable to yourself?

- The fact that not a single soldier died in my company in Afghanistan. There were wounded, hospitalized from loss of strength, but not killed. This was the most awarded unit, and did not lose a single soldier. And for me, as a commander, this is the greatest reward.

Are we done with the war?

Chairman of the Ukrainian Union of Afghanistan Veterans, Major General Sergei CHERVONOPISKY: “The boys had to collect their friends who were blown up by mines piece by piece and put them in two bags so that they were the same in weight.”

20 years ago the last Soviet military units were withdrawn from Afghanistan

In the cemeteries of almost all cities of our country there are entire alleys with inscriptions on gravestones: “Killed in the line of duty.” It was forbidden to indicate that “died in Afghanistan.” During 10 years of hostilities, 3,360 Ukrainians died, 72 disappeared or were captured. About eight thousand people returned wounded from Afghanistan, almost five thousand were disabled... 20 years ago the Ukrainian Union of Afghanistan Veterans was created - someone must speak frankly with the authorities... Nowadays, the USVA represents the interests of more than 200 thousand “Afghans”, as well as veterans of military conflicts in other countries. Its founder, Major General, Doctor of Political Science Sergei Chervonopisky, who returned from his war without both legs, was elected head of the Union for the fourth time. He has been using prosthetics for 27 years, but stubbornly continues to fight - this time for the rights and social protection of his fellow men.

“I DO NOT REGRET AT ALL FOR WHAT I TOLD SAKHAROV”

- Sergey Vasilyevich, when I say: “Chervonopisky”, in response I hear: “Ah, this is the one who was at the first congress people's deputies The USSR opposed Academician Sakharov." The poet Yevgeny Yevtushenko recently said in an interview with Gordon Boulevard that it was on your initiative that Andrei Dmitrievich was slammed...

- Hm... Yes, it was like that. To be more precise, I entered into a fierce debate with him.

- But why?

— I then read in Komsomolskaya Pravda Sakharov’s statement that the Soviet Army had become super immoral and was using combat helicopters to destroy its soldiers in Afghanistan who were surrounded so that they would not be captured... It was a serious statement, and I came out against him with harsh criticism. Sakharov referred to a publication in a Canadian newspaper, but later admitted that he had been fed misinformation.

Those who called themselves democrats were very indignant: they say Chervonopisky is so bad, he dared to raise his voice at Andrei Dmitrievich himself, he offended him... However, after the end Afghan war 20 years have passed, all the deepest secrets of the Soviet Union have already been revealed, but not a single fact confirming the rightness of the academician has been made public. I think, with his activity, shying away from extremes, Sakharov last years life atoned for his sins as the creator of a terrible monster - the hydrogen bomb.

At the same time, I responded to attacks against me, especially from women, with the question: “Tell me, is your son capable of destroying his own in cold blood?” And everyone said: “No, mine couldn’t...”. - “Why do you think that my mother’s son can do this?” I even encountered dirty hints that, by speaking out against Sakharov, I was fulfilling a special order from conservative communists who promised me special prosthetics. At first I was furious, but I walked away and waved it off... It’s just that by that time I was firmly standing on the podium on the prosthetics, by the way, of our master - front-line soldier from Podol, Anatoly Vasilyevich Yurchenko.

By the way, about dentures. After all, American masters tried to “change my shoes.” But we had to fly back from the USA in our “felt boots”... And now the enterprises that have already been raised with the help of our Afghan organization have put their own, Moldovan, and even Russian brothers who returned from the war disabled on their feet. This, by the way, saves a lot of money for the country.

As for Sakharov... Life has completely confirmed that I was right. Fully! I don't regret at all what I said back then. (sighs).

— How did you end up at that historic congress?

— At the congress I was elected as a deputy from the Komsomol - at that time I worked as the first secretary of the Cherkassy city committee of the LKSMU. There were more than 200 candidates, I took third place in terms of the number of points scored...

— Why do you think you grew up so correct and categorical?

— Vysotsky has a song with the words: “So you read the right books as a child...”.

- Wow, they coincided! Here’s what I have planned further: “If, cutting a path with your father’s sword, you wound salty tears on your mustache, if in a hot battle you experienced what it cost, then you read the right books in childhood...”. Cool, though! Or did you look at my cheat sheet?

— (Laughs). Like any boy...

“Was the sword really your father’s?”

- Well, of course. My father is a military man. As a boy, during the Great Patriotic War, he was a partisan (in the detachment, by the way, where the famous Ivan Kalashnik fought). He was not allowed to become a general by one “flaw” in his biography: he was from a dispossessed family. Again, Samir Asanov is sitting next to me. With his people, with the Crimean Tatars, Soviet authority also acted unfairly. However, there are things you step over.

The socialist system has not discredited itself in its fundamentals; another thing is that the leaders of the CPSU brought it to the brink and destroyed it. The subjective factor came into play. This is confirmed at least by the example of China, which is beginning to prosper without changing social system. There is no need to reinvent “democratic” wheels on the path to general prosperity; we just need to correctly build the economy and internal relations in the state. If it were not for poverty, there would be no problems in the CIS now. Over the past 20 years, tens of thousands of people have died in civil strife, and before that they were brothers.

- Yes all! And Remarque, and Hemingway, and Jack London, and Maupassant, and Russian classics - I read them all! My mother, a language and literature teacher, instilled in me a taste for reading. Books about the Afghan war as well, but I prefer them in documentary form. There are too many fairy tales and nonsense in artistic works. Now our team itself has a lot of documentary and scientific works publishes.

“IT WAS IMPOSSIBLE TO GO TO ANTI-TANK MINES, BUT I FUCKED UP AND WENT TO FOLLOW THE ORDER”

— Have you already been to Afghanistan as an officer?

- Yes. He graduated from the Ryazan Airborne School... (Then he also studied at the National Academy of Internal Affairs, in the doctoral studies of the UIA). He fought in the 350th Regiment of the 103rd Vitebsk Guards Airborne Division. We were alerted and thrown there. The task was set to capture the airfields of Kabul and Bagram. They took part, so to speak, in the “restoration of power” of Babrak Karmal, whom the Soviet secret services brought and placed at the head of the country. I was the first commandant of Kabul airport. Well, then he fought like everyone else...

- ...until one fight turned your life upside down?

- It just happened. I had already been promoted to assistant chief of staff of a regiment, I even handed over my unit... I was promoted to fighting. I temporarily served as deputy battalion commander for technical matters - the deputy technical commander had changed, but the new one had not arrived yet. And it was necessary to conduct a convoy of vehicles with food and ammunition. In principle, it was impossible to go there, to look for anti-tank mines, but... I swore and went to carry out the order of the foolish major, an arrogant academy graduate who had never smelled gunpowder.

In a word, I should not have taken part in that battle.

- What do you think this is, fate, an accident?

—(Snorts). Yes, you can call it whatever you want.

— When you were in the hospital, despair set in and you were tormented by dark thoughts?

- You know, no. I am an optimist in life. Of course, the wound was very serious - I felt like I had been to the next world. In fact, I spent a year in the hospital - receiving treatment, adapting to prosthetics, learning to walk on them. But I didn’t doubt for a second that everything would turn out fine: I’d be able to walk, I’d be able to work!

When I came to my homeland, Cherkasy, they gave me an apartment without talking, even though I wasn’t even married yet. I went to work in the city committee of the Komsomol - at first I was in charge of the department, then I was elected second secretary, then first. Up, so to speak, “up the career ladder.” And then he began to create our “Afghan” organization, to support it, and went into business. He spun in a way that no one with arms and legs could ever dream of.

From the Gordon Boulevard dossier.

Only people close to him know how Sergei Chervonopisky got up on prosthetics. He himself does not like to talk about it. After amputation, he was left with 15 centimeters of one leg and nine centimeters of the other. Medical experts say that walking with a cane is impossible with such amputations. He is a unique case in the world.

— Have you ever been tempted to give up everything to hell and live “like an ordinary disabled person”?

- Of course it was, how could we not have done it! (Smiles). Even now I sometimes tell the guys: “Guys, if you bother me, I’ll throw you to hell!” I’ll go fishing!” But seriously, I’m unlikely to be able to leave the business I’m doing.

— Many “Afghans” not only justify, but also do not curse the war in which they participated...

- And not because that war is part own life. To understand why, one would have to live at that time, understand the thoughts of people, their upbringing. After all, many themselves asked to volunteer for Afghanistan - no one sent them by force. And they asked not out of bloodthirstiness, not out of a desire to rob or kill someone...

- ...But then the Crimean poet Konstantin Frolov accused: “Afghanistan - how interesting it is! Here you can rob, burn and kill!..."...

“And he was not alone in his opinion. However, volunteers went to Afghanistan because that’s how they were raised: the borders of the homeland are the borders of the homeland, and they need to be protected. Now in Ukraine the spirit of that patriotic education is gone. Especially among young people, who, even if they agree somewhere in hot spot go only to earn money. The attitude towards the army has changed dramatically - this is scary, very scary!

“Afghans” are painfully hurt by such nasty words as “aggression”, “intervention”, “occupation”, “war without victory”, “criminal war”... Let them remain on the conscience of the narrow-minded people who, having broken through to power, today They shout: “Ukraine did not fight in Afghanistan!” And thousands of disabled people, widows and orphans, whose are they? Maybe for some this is a rhetorical question, but not for people like me... What I remember more is the friendship, the relationships that were there in the combat zone.

—What do you remember most about your peaceful life? What gave you strength when your usual foundations collapsed?

- The most important thing was the birth of children: a son, now he is almost 25, and then a daughter... And the war continues for me, because it left a big “gift” - two prostheses. And with them there is a problem that cannot be solved, no matter how hard you try. Everything else is fixable and surmountable.

- You spoke about your children with such love, but you keep something quiet about your wife... Taboo?

- Yes, somehow this is not accepted in our family. I'm a public person. I shine on pages and screens a good hundred times a year... If you think that the family is proud of this, then you are mistaken. She's getting tired. My wife especially... But I cannot help but appreciate and respect the feelings, moods, desires and wishes of my Natalya. After all, I met her on home leave, being a brave paratrooper officer... Yes, it was impossible not to fall in love with her! (Smiles).

Well, then Afghan... and we got married much later. And before that, for a year, my Petrovna, as we lovingly call her in the family, was running to the Kiev hospital from near Cherkassy every Sunday... That’s why I go... In general, I’m confident.

“THE TOPIC OF THE PRIMITIVE SURRENDER OF THE SOVIET UNION STILL PISSES ME OFF”

— After the withdrawal of Soviet troops from Afghanistan, not only Academician Sakharov - a very significant part civil society didn’t accept the “Afghans”, avoided them... Has the attitude changed now?

— The reasons for society’s attitude towards this or that event do not lie on the surface. To understand this, just look at what the funds did mass media during the Georgian-Ossetian conflict. After all, it was a complete lie! Total twist! Not “double standards”, but double lies! Now, however, the situation is gradually leveling out. I personally react painfully to the behavior of our government. Well, what did the prohibitive measures do to show the Russian film “War 08.08.08” in Ukraine? They only spurred interest in a film product that was far from being the best. Someone promoted himself in a special information operation, and someone once again set himself up... It’s a shame for the state!

I don't want to get into big politics. I will say this: my Afghan brothers live in both South Ossetia and Georgia. They have different truths, but each of us, scorched by our war, is against letting the guns talk, because the victim of military-political ambitions and showdowns will always be the common man. Diplomats must go ahead of the tanks.

By the way, my Russian “Afghans” friends told me that during the 40 days of sister cities in Ossetia they remembered the dead standing, silently and to the dregs they drank our third “Afghan” toast... And in the fourth they unexpectedly said: “For forgiving the Georgians! " And none of the good hundred people present objected... Keep in mind - this is the Caucasus, where there are traditions of blood feud...

— Do you want to say that society’s biased attitude towards “Afghans” is the work of the media?

- Exactly. I met with some of the journalist guys who were frantically (to please the emerging influence of the States) in unison with Sakharov, throwing mud at the collapsing Soviet Union, I personally was rinsed with all, as they say, proletarian hatred... Now they regret: “What fools we were!” They come up: “Sergey, I’m sorry! You openly addressed the press, but we didn’t understand you then!” I really want Sakharov to be alive. How would he evaluate what the Americans did with Yugoslavia, what they are doing in Iraq, in Afghanistan?.. How would he now - in himself a good, decent, honest person! — commented on this? Which side would you be on today?

— Will the war of 08.08.08 change the world? Not the film, but the tragic events themselves?

— I would not like changes in geopolitical terms. And the fact that other countries allowed themselves a different opinion from the American one about what happened is already good. Normal people they figured out that the outrage was staged solely for McCain’s victory in the presidential race.

— A few days after the end of the “five-day war” in Georgia, Russian Prime Minister Vladimir Putin said: “We are being offered a choice: sausage or life. We choose life." What do you think Ukraine prefers?

— How can I tell you... At one time I had a small conflict with Gorbachev. I was then a member of the USSR Supreme Soviet Commission on International Affairs. I went on a business trip to Cuba and spoke there before our diplomatic corps. Well, the diplomats asked a direct question: “Sergei Vasilyevich, we live for a long time far from our country, from the outside we see what changes need to be made in this or that area of ​​life. We are preparing a lot of materials for the government, but the authorities are ignoring them. We recommend one thing - do the opposite. Why?". I answered: “Dear comrade diplomats! In the East I heard a wisdom that says: “A flock of rams led by a lion is stronger than a flock of lions led by a ram.” When this was reported to Gorbachev, he stopped greeting me! (Laughs).

- The man of Eastern wisdom did not understand...

“What’s worse is that the Secretary General, the first person of the state with powers greater than those of the sovereign-emperor, personally betrayed his state - he chose sausage...

Let it not seem that I am so chronically nostalgic for the Soviet era, that I live in yesterday. Our team is patriotically concerned about the development of our native Ukrainian state. But the topic of the primitive surrender of the mighty Union still infuriates me.

- Such a state structure - the Committee for Veterans Affairs, which you headed - did not exist in any republic of the former USSR...

— The Committee on the Affairs of Soldiers-Internationalists under the President of Ukraine originated during the time of Leonid Kravchuk. When we, with real work, proved the need for such a unification, the State Committee for Veterans Affairs was formed, which fulfilled the functions assigned by us, the “Afghans” - defending the interests of veterans, solving their problems. But with the advent of the “Orange” government, we were no longer needed - the Committee was liquidated.

— Viktor Yushchenko, having become President, dispersed your Committee twice. But why?

“Why is that a question for him?” He issued several decrees on the liquidation of the Veterans Affairs Committee. The latter was signed two months before the 60th anniversary of the Victory, just on Hitler’s birthday.

In all likelihood, the authorities were very unhappy with the policy pursued by me and the Committee I headed. We have been and remain active opponents of excessive glorification and mythologization of Banderaism and the exaltation of nationalist ideology. I'm not talking about those who fought against the Nazis in the ranks of the Ukrainian Insurgent Army. However, I categorically disagree with rehabilitating those who took the side of fascism and opposed the Red Army. It is difficult to justify a crime with some lofty goals. Unfortunately, there are enough helpful historians who are ready to fulfill this kind of “state order” and provide any “historical” basis to please the political situation. But does this contribute to the establishment of peace in Ukrainian souls?

“THOSE THIRSTING FOR BLOODY CLASHES ON POLITICAL BASIS CAN NOT COUNT ON AFGHANS”

— How did the Phoenix rise from the ashes?

— By that time, I was already a deputy of the Verkhovna Rada, and I did serious work among my fellow deputies. And when the issue of the Veterans Affairs Committee was put to a vote, the Verkhovna Rada of the fifth convocation restored it with 364 votes. Even the BYuT faction voted “for” - in full force. Therefore, in this case, as an honest person, I cannot say anything against Yulia Tymoshenko. She supported us one hundred percent.

Now, unfortunately, veterans are offended by our Committee. In fact, it has been restored, but its work is unfolding extremely slowly. For various reasons. But, as they say, it’s not evening yet... Let’s improve the situation.

— Some part of society, for example, in the pro-Russian Crimea, is inclined to perceive the “Afghans” as a kind of paramilitary bloc and counts on their support.

— Yeah, the Russian population of Crimea wants to go to Russia, the Tatar population, apparently, to Turkey... I’ll say this about this: our organization is not paramilitary. This is an association of true military men who know war not from books... And those who have seen a real war are always its most real opponent! The worst thing about war is not even the war itself, but its consequences. I am sure of this because I am now helping mothers, orphans, and the disabled. Those thirsty for some kind of bloody clashes on political grounds can’t count on the “Afghans”.

The unity of the “Afghan” organization frightens those who have unclean souls. It only makes people with pure thoughts happy.

— How many “Afghans” are there in Ukraine now?

— About 150 thousand.

— You recently said that after the war in some regions of Ukraine, more “Afghans” died than died during the fighting in Afghanistan...

— And I repeat: not just more, but several times... In Zhitomir, say, almost seven. According to our regional organizations and military registration and enlistment offices, every week we bury one of the guys.

Today average age"Afghans" - 45 years old. Young men, facing the consequences of war, find themselves powerless. Injuries, being in an alien climate, and diseases unusual for Europeans, including typhus and malaria, take their toll. And the consequences of psychological trauma! Post-traumatic syndromes!

An 18-year-old boy from his mother and father, from his school desk, found himself in conditions where he could be killed every second, he himself was forced to kill... This is a powerful blow to the fragile psyche and nervous system! And the boys still had to pick up their soldier friends who were blown up by mines piece by piece and put them in two plastic bags so that they were the same in weight... Imagine what it’s like for a yesterday’s child and what’s happening to him now, having grown up. Sorry for the naturalism.

— Vladimir Mazur has a song “Afghan Statistics”: “Every third person has no more strength to prove anything else, but every fourth person has not yet cooled down and is ready to continue to fight... Every eighth person came with orders, and they told him: “ Hero!". Now everything has been debunked to smithereens - who is taking this war into account?..” And then: every sixth goes into religion, every 20th drinks heavily, 30th is on a needle, 100th is in prison, every 300th returned without arms or legs... It turns out that God saved him in the war a person from death, but heavenly protection is no longer enough for a peaceful life...

- I am a believer. Not into fanaticism, but a believer. However, I wouldn’t blame everything on God. There are limits to human endurance, and at a certain point the body's defenses fail. They wear out like a car engine, and problems begin...

There are politicians who really want us... to disappear. So that they do not interfere with the implementation of their ephemeral ideas. They just want something to be done - and we’re not there! But this will not happen, thank God. The times when the prevailing principle: “No person, no problem” are over.

— Who was the initiator of the elimination of “Afghan” benefits?

- Yes, that’s it... Prime Minister Lazarenko started, and all subsequent governments of Ukraine did just that! (Sighs wearily).

“I WARN EVERYONE: WE WILL STOP THE DESTRUCTION OF AFGHAN WARRIORS”

— And benefits are not the only problem for the “Afghans”?

- Wow, yes definitely! Isn’t the problem the continuous humiliation of participants in the world’s local conflicts? Iraq veterans have already picketed the government. Young guys who conquered the Middle East are also forced to defend their rights. And the number of such Iraqis has already exceeded a dozen. Over the years, Ukraine has also fought a lot of wars on the sly, to please the United States. Plus those 24 countries in which Soviet internationalist soldiers once “planted trees.”

— What problems do you have to solve today?

“There are plenty of them at all levels, since the Law “On the Status of War Veterans and Guarantees of Their Social Protection” is shamelessly violated; in fact, it does not work. The housing problem remains acute: people stand in line for 15 years... Only 45 thousand “Afghans” need it.

The families of the victims receive, it’s just funny to say, 40 hryvnia per dead son or husband. This is completely out of the question! These amounts are meager—a mockery elevated to the level of state policy.

— Two years ago you publicly renounced the Order of Yaroslav the Wise. Was it a demarche, disagreement with the policies of Viktor Yushchenko?

- Of course not. More precisely, there is no need to simplify everything so much. I had several clashes with Yushchenko, but they were all connected with protecting the interests of my brothers-in-arms, with social affairs. If I do not accept the passive ideology that Bankovaya is currently implanting in Ukraine, this is secondary. Viktor Andreevich became the initiator of the formation of Ukrainian identity in our country, a kind of pioneer, and with this he will go down in history. But judge for yourself: many veterans are “bending over” from the lack of the most basic things, and the whole country is “bending over” to the Holodomor, NATO, OUN-UPA, the local church... Sometimes this also infuriates!

You see, I value my military awards... And if I accepted the Order of Yaroslav, I would seem to agree with all the injustice around veteran internationalists. This would not add to my respect in the eyes of my comrades in arms. People at war are generally characterized by a heightened sense of justice. Both society and senior government officials should take this into account.

— So, are your protests reaching the bureaucrats’ brains?

— Any protest is an indicator of the people’s opinion, and it has a certain impact. Another thing is that now the state apparatus has already developed a certain immunity to noisy actions and protest opinions. Therefore, just to get people to pay attention to us, we blocked all the entrances to the Cabinet of Ministers building, and these kinds of lessons work. I warned and am warning everyone concerned: we will stop the destruction of “Afghan” veterans... If necessary, we will dismantle the Ministry of Labor and Social Policy brick by brick.

“THE POSITION: “THE LESS YOU KNOW IS A GRAVE LATER” IS NOT FOR ME. WE'VE ALREADY BEEN HERE"

— On the Internet I found a so-called black list of domestic politicians, in which your name is included.

- Seriously? Honestly, I have no idea! I didn't even know such a list existed. We need to look. And I wonder, is it “black” - for whom? For the “Afghans”, for the disabled, for the families of the victims, for the orphans, am I on the blacklist? And if it’s for the authorities, I don’t mind. In any case, I am not going to remain silent. The position of the famous cartoon ostrich: “The less you know, the later your grave” is not for me. We've already been through this.

— Do you think you are a conflicted person?

- Maybe tough in some ways. But there is no conflict in nature. Hard - yes, very hard.

— Besides social activities, what else do you have time to do?

- Wow, a lot of things! I love hunting, fishing... I read a lot. And there is enough time for family.

-What do you live on?

— If I tell you that I’m retiring, will you believe me?

—Looking at your Subaru? Of course not.

- Right. I receive a pension and a salary. And, of course, I make money decent life. I won’t say that he’s such a cool businessman. In our state, all business issues can be resolved either through acquaintances or through bribes. I do this with the help of friends who do not take kickbacks. With their help, the Union of Afghanistan Veterans can be kept afloat.

— Despite the fact that you don’t have benefits in business?

— And at one time we consciously abandoned them. After all, the state also provided us with preferences in the early 90s, and quite decent ones. But so-and-so criminals came to us!.. There was no end to the bandits with their “business” offers.

There was another reason for the refusal - ours, internal. If you remember, in Russia in the mid-90s there were severe “Afghan” showdowns: an explosion at the Kotlyakovsky cemetery, the murders of several regional leaders of disabled organizations. It was a shark-like, merciless time. And very fat flies swarmed around the tasty morsel thrown in by Yeltsin... The neighbors are still reaping the fruits of that dump today: they have several alternative all-Russian organizations and more than two hundred independent locals. We turned out to be smarter. The face of the Ukrainian “Afghans” is represented only by the USVA.

— What place do friends occupy in your life?

— After family, the most important thing.

- What are you dreaming about, Comrade Major General?

- Complex issue. For every normal man, every decent person, the main thing is that their children and grandchildren are happy and their loved ones are healthy. With a peaceful sky overhead. May everyone live in abundance and love. I would like life to be built according to the canons of the Bible, the Koran, the Talmud - the postulates, in my opinion, are the same everywhere. Don't think you're so devout, but holy books- this is the mind of humanity, and we must live without forgetting them.

P.S.For assistance in organizing the interview, “Gordon Boulevard” expresses gratitude to the assistant to the chairman of the USVA (Ukrainian Union of Afghan Warriors) Vladimir Siroshtan, the head of the Yevpatoria branch of the USVA Samir Asanov and board activist Alexander Kurakin.